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Dennis Post subject:
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shootthebusstop wrote:
Dennis wrote:
SpartyScott wrote:
Dennis wrote:
One After 909: "Move over once, move over twice, come on baby don't be cold as ice". Not exactly inspired lyrics. One of their early songs, and not one of their best by a long shot. Everybody's seen the rooftop sequence because it's the best thing in the film. The rest of the film is something of an endurance test, even if it is The Beatles.
MMT is much the same, despite the great songs.


It's fun rock and roll, and nothing more. And George's guitar solo along with Billy Preston's piano make the song entertaining, at least to me.

And sure it's not one of their best - they did fail to release it in 1963, after all. But there's no shame in not being one of the Beatles' best, considering they have about 50 songs that are classics and recognized by almost everyone in the English-speaking world.


Still, it begs the question, why redo an old song from their early days that wasn't good enough to put out even back then? Beatles fans do get touchy about their group, but after all, they were only human. I love The Beatles as much as anyone, but it's better to be objective than just say everything The Beatles did was great, when it clearly wasn't. How about "You Know My Name"? That was a terrible track that should never have come out. I remember being rather aghast that such a poor track had The Beatles name attached to it. I think it's indicative of how the group was losing their way towards the end, making decisions that really should have been thought through more sensibly. My instinct tells me that if Brian Epstein had been alive during these times, he would have nixed some of these things that didn't show the group in a totally favorable light.
Yes, I think like alot of people that the group lost their way after Brian died and they never fully recovered.I'm as big a Beatles fan as you can get but I think it was better that the band broke up when they did.I'm not at all keen on their final recordings.You can tell that the collaboration wasn't there anymore and the music suffered Crying or Very sad .(But that is only MY opinion!)


I agree. I'm not even that keen on "Abbey Road", a favorite of many fans apparently, for reasons I fail to grasp. If I were to name a favorite Beatles LP, I would go in the total opposite direction and pick "Please Please Me". I love that album, with a great balance of well-chosen covers, such as "Twist And Shout", "A Taste of Honey", and "Boys", along with some of their most delightfully melodic original songs, such as my favorites, "Misery" and "There's A Place", and the rocking "I Saw Her Standing There". I think the early stuff holds up best, with its freshness and vitality.
PostPosted:Sat Nov 10, 2007 16:44 pm
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benny-b-goode Post subject:
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"Abbey Road" shows that the magic of The Beatles was still there. That was quite a surprise because it was recorded after the Let it Be album. It was their final reunion. The end product became my favourite Beatles album.
It starts with the coolest Beatles song ever "Come Together", it has nice melodic Harrison songs in it ("Something", "Here Comes The Sun"), "Oh Darling" with a Paul at his best (his singing is extremely emotional), a great classical tune with great harmony vocals ("Beacuse") and two great medleys with the returning of the melody of "You Gave Me No Money" in "Golden Slumbers" what makes this album more coherent and conceptual than "Sgt. Pepper". It is the only album where all four members contribute great numbers and even some of their most popular ones. Even Ringo wrote a Beatles classic himself ("Octopus's Garden").
Because of all this "Abbey Road" will always remain the best Beatles album for me (and perhaps the best album ever).
PostPosted:Sun Nov 11, 2007 12:50 pm
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Dennis Post subject:
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benny-b-goode wrote:
"Abbey Road" shows that the magic of The Beatles was still there. That was quite a surprise because it was recorded after the Let it Be album. It was their final reunion. The end product became my favourite Beatles album.
It starts with the coolest Beatles song ever "Come Together", it has nice melodic Harrison songs in it ("Something", "Here Comes The Sun"), "Oh Darling" with a Paul at his best (his singing is extremely emotional), a great classical tune with great harmony vocals ("Beacuse") and two great medleys with the returning of the melody of "You Gave Me No Money" in "Golden Slumbers" what makes this album more coherent and conceptual than "Sgt. Pepper". It is the only album where all four members contribute great numbers and even some of their most popular ones. Even Ringo wrote a Beatles classic himself ("Octopus's Garden").
Because of all this "Abbey Road" will always remain the best Beatles album for me (and perhaps the best album ever).


"Abbey Road" is a fine album, no doubt, but I view it as a bit overrated. But "Octopus's Garden" a classic? I put that one on the shelf with other Ringo duds like "What Goes On" (why on earth did they begin Side 2 of "Rubber Soul" (UK version) with such a weak track?) and "Don't Pass Me By". I do like "Act Naturally", "Boys", and "I Wanna Be Your Man" however.
PostPosted:Sun Nov 11, 2007 17:22 pm
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DistantLight Post subject:
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Some time ago "Octpous's Harden" was my favorite song and I still love it. It's cool... great guitars, a good tune and good singing. For me it's Ringo's best moment with the Beatles and I would also call this song a Beatles classic.

And Abbey Road is also my favorite album of all time I guess - second is Distant Light by the way.
PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 7:53 am
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Dennis Post subject:
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DistantLight wrote:
Some time ago "Octpous's Harden" was my favorite song and I still love it. It's cool... great guitars, a good tune and good singing. For me it's Ringo's best moment with the Beatles and I would also call this song a Beatles classic.

And Abbey Road is also my favorite album of all time I guess - second is Distant Light by the way.


In the same vein, I'll take "Yellow Submarine" instead, which is clearly superior in every way, and was a hit, something "Octopus..." was not.

The Beatles should be open to critical analysis like every other band, but too many fans just say everything was great and leave it at that. I disagree with giving The Beatles a free pass when it comes to the quality of their music. They recorded a great many wonderful things but also some that don't measure up.
PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 17:13 pm
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Vrinda Post subject:
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Quote:
The Beatles should be open to critical analysis like every other band, but too many fans just say everything was great and leave it at that. I disagree with giving The Beatles a free pass when it comes to the quality of their music. They recorded a great many wonderful things but also some that don't measure up.


Critical analysis is fine, but if it resorts to taking everything and ripping it apart, like some people do, than it's overblown. There were some morons on YouTube who started that commonplace, annoying Beatles vs. name-the-band-of-your-choice nonsense. Guess who the other band in this case was? Yes, you got it! And they were deliberating back and forth on the "I'm Alive" video. The problem there was that these idiots were only citing "I am the Walrus" in their rantings, stating that it was not a good song, and was overrated. I don't care for it that much, either, but it is not representative of the Beatles' entire body of work. These people went on to say that it was part of the Beatles' '70s material, and that their '7-0s material wasn't any good. (Last time I checked, these guys broke up in 1970 and had recorded no new material that year. "Let it Be" was reocorded the year before and released in 1970, but does not accurately represent the Beatles' '70s work, if there was any.) When I pointed that out, one woman responded, "That walrus rubbish was 1970," as if now that she's said so, it's law. Now, that does not change the facts any. It was released in 1967, unless there was a reissue later on, but for these people to rant on about it looked so silly, and it showed how little they knew about the Beatles. As for making the argument that the Hollies were better, it fell flat and made Hollies fans look bad. If you're going to be critical, know what you're talking about. This is not directed at you, Dennis, but your post reminded me of that whole incident.
PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 18:25 pm
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SpartyScott Post subject:
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The Beatles "70's work" was pretty much limited to George, Paul, and Ringo cranking out I Me Mine so that it could be included in the movie.

Certainly the Abbey Road album wasn't finished well before 12/31/69, and of course the Let It Be albums was recorded even before that (with the lone exception being a session to finish the one song listed above).
PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 19:15 pm
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Gee Post subject:
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Interesting point Vrinda - I think things go in "Fashions"....there WAS a time back in the sixties when The Beatles certainly WERE criticised by some...."Help !" (the film & songs) took a critical appraisal....with some critics being most unfavorable too (including of the film - John Lennon himself !)....then the "Mystery Tour" etc....mercilessly crucified with glee....!
PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 19:52 pm

Last edited by Gee on Sun May 23, 2010 10:25 am; edited 1 time in total
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Gee Post subject:
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...As Scott says they did finish "I Me Mine" at a session on 3 January 1970 .... but minus John Lennon
PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 20:06 pm

Last edited by Gee on Sun May 23, 2010 10:22 am; edited 1 time in total
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Vrinda Post subject:
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Thanks, Geoff! Maybe, in time, it will become fashionable not to pick on the Beatles again!

It's ironic now that people didn't like Help! when it was first released. The critics acted as if the Beatles were supposed to churn out some Oscar-winning masterpiece like A Hard Day's Night. Today, it's just a fun little comedy where you can see some exotic scenery, laugh at the James Bondish-gags, and see the Beatles act their craziest!
PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 20:52 pm
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shootthebusstop Post subject:
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When I first got into the Beatles in 1979 it was so uncool and then John was shot and Beatles stuff was everywhere.John became a saint and as a young teenager who loved him passionately I fell into that trap Rolling Eyes .With age and wisdom I now see that I was being foolish because I completely underestimated Paul until recently Embarassed I was totally taken in by the Lennon hype in the media .(I still love John but now I am more informed and not so blinkered).At the moment Beatle images are everywhere you look .I fear that this is because they are "Trendy".That's all well and good(my daughter loves them)but I worry that young people just" think" they like the Beatles cos they've been told that they are gods that never ever wrote anything other that classics .So I agree with you Dennis here to a certain extent,The Beatles didn't always write amazingly good songs(just most of the time Wink ).My daughter's friend recently had a Beatles t-shirt on and I asked her could she name any of the band.She couldn't Rolling Eyes .So I sat her down and talked to her about them and we listened to some of their music and she realized they were good.I agree with Geoff.The media can hype things up tremendously and fashions come and go.What I think is important is that we listen to and enjoy music because we love it,not because we are susposed to love it.It should make us cry,laugh,love,dance,sing,feel alive.You can critically analysize til you are blue in the face,and yes it can be interesting Smile and I do enjoy it to a point .But I agree with Vrinda here, if a piece of music doesn't make the hairs on the back of your neck stand up ,what's the point.I too am not directing this to anyone on the Forum either ,after all discussions are what the forum is all about and I love reading EVERYONE'S posts.But I too have seen some terrible comments on youtube that make me ashamed to be a music lover Twisted Evil .

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PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 20:59 pm
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Vrinda Post subject:
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That was very well-written, Paula. The story about your friend's daughter sounds like something I've been hearing from others as well. I even heard about a friend's brother who was wearing a Beatles' T-shirt. He said he didn't like them because, "They were old and they're music s*cked." (My apologies. These were his words, not mine.) But he still liked the shirt so that was why he was wearing it. Shocked My friend, who knows who the Beatles are, just not much about them, told him he wasn't making any sense and when she asked him what of their music he's listened to, he said he never heard any. It was just the trend at his high school to shun any music done before the 1990s because anything from before then couldn't possibly be good. Hopefully, the kid wised up.

You will always have music that you don't like, and that's fine. You should know why you like what you like and why you don't like what you don't like, but don't shrug something off just because "it's old." I even like popular standards from the 1930s - '40s, along with the '50s and '60s rock 'n' roll and pop. People find that amazing. They never thought you could like both. I developed a taste for them when I got to be a teenager and in college, when a local radio station would play these songs at night. Having varied tastes in music helps you to become more discerning, and to know what will make your ears open up. The media will try to influence you as it always has, and in the end, it's up tp what pleases your eardrums that decides what you deem to be quality music or not.
PostPosted:Mon Nov 12, 2007 21:11 pm
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Dennis Post subject:
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Vrinda wrote:
Quote:
The Beatles should be open to critical analysis like every other band, but too many fans just say everything was great and leave it at that. I disagree with giving The Beatles a free pass when it comes to the quality of their music. They recorded a great many wonderful things but also some that don't measure up.


Critical analysis is fine, but if it resorts to taking everything and ripping it apart, like some people do, than it's overblown. There were some morons on YouTube who started that commonplace, annoying Beatles vs. name-the-band-of-your-choice nonsense. Guess who the other band in this case was? Yes, you got it! And they were deliberating back and forth on the "I'm Alive" video. The problem there was that these idiots were only citing "I am the Walrus" in their rantings, stating that it was not a good song, and was overrated. I don't care for it that much, either, but it is not representative of the Beatles' entire body of work. These people went on to say that it was part of the Beatles' '70s material, and that their '7-0s material wasn't any good. (Last time I checked, these guys broke up in 1970 and had recorded no new material that year. "Let it Be" was reocorded the year before and released in 1970, but does not accurately represent the Beatles' '70s work, if there was any.) When I pointed that out, one woman responded, "That walrus rubbish was 1970," as if now that she's said so, it's law. Now, that does not change the facts any. It was released in 1967, unless there was a reissue later on, but for these people to rant on about it looked so silly, and it showed how little they knew about the Beatles. As for making the argument that the Hollies were better, it fell flat and made Hollies fans look bad. If you're going to be critical, know what you're talking about. This is not directed at you, Dennis, but your post reminded me of that whole incident.


I am not a bratty teenager who posts nonsense things on YouTube, so I take exception to your comment. I happen to be a knowledgeable music buff, in case you haven't noticed. The generation growing up now hears all the great music from the 60s and 70s second hand, so naturally they are going to be cynical. I think it is based on jealousy and envy of those of us who grew up with the greatest era of popular music. They want to think that the music of their generation is best, which of course it isn't.

And what about The Rolling Stones? The vast majority of their 1960s output is great, too, but there were occasional missteps, such as "We Love You". Not even The Beatles' presence in the studio, doing background vocals, could elevate this track into something worthwhile. "We Love You" was easily their worst A-side single of the '60s. Fortunately, London Records in the US had the good sense to push the flipside, "Dandelion" instead, which is definitely the better of the two tracks. Moral of the story: every band, no matter how great, can record a less-than-spectacular track on occasion.
PostPosted:Tue Nov 13, 2007 2:24 am
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Vrinda Post subject:
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Dennis wrote:
Vrinda wrote:
Quote:
The Beatles should be open to critical analysis like every other band, but too many fans just say everything was great and leave it at that. I disagree with giving The Beatles a free pass when it comes to the quality of their music. They recorded a great many wonderful things but also some that don't measure up.


Critical analysis is fine, but if it resorts to taking everything and ripping it apart, like some people do, than it's overblown. There were some morons on YouTube who started that commonplace, annoying Beatles vs. name-the-band-of-your-choice nonsense. Guess who the other band in this case was? Yes, you got it! And they were deliberating back and forth on the "I'm Alive" video. The problem there was that these idiots were only citing "I am the Walrus" in their rantings, stating that it was not a good song, and was overrated. I don't care for it that much, either, but it is not representative of the Beatles' entire body of work. These people went on to say that it was part of the Beatles' '70s material, and that their '7-0s material wasn't any good. (Last time I checked, these guys broke up in 1970 and had recorded no new material that year. "Let it Be" was reocorded the year before and released in 1970, but does not accurately represent the Beatles' '70s work, if there was any.) When I pointed that out, one woman responded, "That walrus rubbish was 1970," as if now that she's said so, it's law. Now, that does not change the facts any. It was released in 1967, unless there was a reissue later on, but for these people to rant on about it looked so silly, and it showed how little they knew about the Beatles. As for making the argument that the Hollies were better, it fell flat and made Hollies fans look bad. If you're going to be critical, know what you're talking about. This is not directed at you, Dennis, but your post reminded me of that whole incident.


I am not a bratty teenager who posts nonsense things on YouTube, so I take exception to your comment. I happen to be a knowledgeable music buff, in case you haven't noticed. The generation growing up now hears all the great music from the 60s and 70s second hand, so naturally they are going to be cynical. I think it is based on jealousy and envy of those of us who grew up with the greatest era of popular music. They want to think that the music of their generation is best, which of course it isn't.

And what about The Rolling Stones? The vast majority of their 1960s output is great, too, but there were occasional missteps, such as "We Love You". Not even The Beatles' presence in the studio, doing background vocals, could elevate this track into something worthwhile. "We Love You" was easily their worst A-side single of the '60s. Fortunately, London Records in the US had the good sense to push the flipside, "Dandelion" instead, which is definitely the better of the two tracks. Moral of the story: every band, no matter how great, can record a less-than-spectacular track on occasion.


I never said you were a bratty teenage posting comments on YouTube, and if you read my post to the very end, you would have seen that was not criticism of you. If you take offense at my comment, I can only imagine what else would get to you. In fact, I've seen some pretty nasty comments not only coming from bratty teens, but from people in their forties, including some Stones fans. These people think the Stones are better than everybody, and if you disagree, they come back at you with a barrage of foul language-laden posts. Those people I mentioned in my post were also people in their thirties to forties. The teenagers were next to none on the Hollies videos.
PostPosted:Tue Nov 13, 2007 3:25 am
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shootthebusstop Post subject:
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Vrinda wrote:
That was very well-written, Paula. The story about your friend's daughter sounds like something I've been hearing from others as well. I even heard about a friend's brother who was wearing a Beatles' T-shirt. He said he didn't like them because, "They were old and they're music s*cked." (My apologies. These were his words, not mine.) But he still liked the shirt so that was why he was wearing it. Shocked My friend, who knows who the Beatles are, just not much about them, told him he wasn't making any sense and when she asked him what of their music he's listened to, he said he never heard any. It was just the trend at his high school to shun any music done before the 1990s because anything from before then couldn't possibly be good. Hopefully, the kid wised up.

You will always have music that you don't like, and that's fine. You should know why you like what you like and why you don't like what you don't like, but don't shrug something off just because "it's old." I even like popular standards from the 1930s - '40s, along with the '50s and '60s rock 'n' roll and pop. People find that amazing. They never thought you could like both. I developed a taste for them when I got to be a teenager and in college, when a local radio station would play these songs at night. Having varied tastes in music helps you to become more discerning, and to know what will make your ears open up. The media will try to influence you as it always has, and in the end, it's up tp what pleases your eardrums that decides what you deem to be quality music or not.
Hear,hear,Vrinda.I like classical music going back to the early 18th century(and no I wasn't around then to hear it first hand Laughing )That was the popular music of it's day.All I will say is, thank God for music and having the ears to appreciate it Very Happy Very Happy .

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PostPosted:Tue Nov 13, 2007 13:32 pm
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